Original Document

John W. Nelson's Testimony Before the House un-American Activities Committee, March 11, 1959.

COMMITTEE ON UN-AMERICAN ACTIVITIES
United States House of Representatives
FRANCIS E. WALTER, Pennsylvania, Chairman
MORGAN M. MOULDER, Missouri
DONALD L. JACKSON, California
CLYDE DOYLE, California
GORDON H. SCHERER, Ohio
EDWIN E. WILLIS, Louisiana
WILLIAM E. MILLER, New York
WILLIAM M. TUCK, Virginia
AUGUST E. JOHANSEN, Michigan
Richard Arens, Staff Director


Mr. Willis. The subcommittee will please come to order and counsel will call the next witness.

Mr. Arens. John W. Nelson, kindly come forward and remain standing while the Chairman administers an oath.

Mr. Willis. Please raise your right hand. Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God.

Mr. Nelson. I do.

Mr. Donner. May the cameras be halted?

Mr. Willis. Yes.

TESTIMONY OF JOHN W. NELSON, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL, FRANK J. DONNER

Mr. Arens. Kindly identify yourself by name, residence, and occupation.

Mr. Nelson. John W. Nelson, 2656 Putnam Drive, Erie, Pa. I am President of Local 506 of the United Electrical, Radio and Machine Workers.

Mr. Arens. Please tell us, Mr. Nelson, the jurisdiction geographically of Local 506?

Mr. Nelson. Local 506 is the certified bargaining agent for the production and maintenance workers at the Erie plant at the General Electric Company.

Mr. Arens. And how many persons are in Local 506, please, sir?

Mr. Nelson. At the present time, due to considerable number of layoffs, I would say approximately 2,500.

Mr. Arens. How long have you been president of 506?

Mr. Nelson. I have been the president for fifteen years.

Mr. Arens. Where are you employed?

Mr. Nelson. I am employed, as I stated, by Local 506 at the United Electrical Workers.

Mr. Arens. I said where. Where is your place of employment?

Mr. Nelson. In Erie, Pennsylvania.

Mr. Arens. Where in Erie, Pennsylvania?

Mr. Nelson. 3923 Main Street.

Mr. Arens. Have you ever been employed

Mr. Willis. Identify counsel.

Mr. Arens. I beg your pardon. You are appearing today in response to a subpoena which was served upon you by the House Committee on Un-American Activities?

Mr. Nelson. For no other reason.

Mr. Arens. You are represented by counsel?

Mr. Nelson. I am.

Mr. Arens. Counsel, kindly identify yourself.

Mr. Donner. My name is Frank J. Donner. My, office is 342 Madison Avenue, New York City.

Mr. Arens. During the last fifteen years, you say you have been president of Local 506?

Mr. Nelson. That is correct.

Mr. Arens. Have you been employed elsewhere in addition to your presidency of Local 506 in the course of that period of time? Mr.

Nelson. Yes.

Mr. Arens. Give us the principal employments which you have had in addition to your presidency of Local 506, please.

Mr. Nelson. I was employed by the General Electric Company.

Mr. Arens. Over what period of time, please, sir?

Mr. Nelson. From May 1, 1941, until March 11, 1954.

Mr. Arens. In what capacity were you employed by GE?

Mr. Nelson. I was a machine setup man.

Mr. Arens. And what caused your disassociation from GE in 1954?

Mr. Nelson. I was discharged from the General Electric Company on that date.

Mr. Arens. Why?

Mr. Nelson. Because I had appeared previously as you well know, you are counsel for the Butler Committee, and because I availed myself of my constitutional privilege I was discharged by the General Electric Company.

Mr. Arens. But you continued as president of Local 506, is that correct?

Mr. Nelson. I did.

Mr. Arens. Was your period of service as president of Local 506 interrupted in any manner?

Mr. Nelson. No.

Mr. Arens. Suspended in any manner after your appearance before the Internal Security Subcommittee and after your discharge from General Electric in 1954 ?.....

Mr. Nelson. No. I think it is quite obvious that my membership had a better appreciation of the constitutional rights of American citizens than did the General Electric Company and therefore there was no interruption in my tenor as president.

Mr. Scherer. Did the General Electric Company discharge you, as you say, because you involved the Fifth Amendment when asked about your Communist Party membership by the Senate Internal Security Subcommittee or did it discharge you because of the evidence that was adduced concerning your Communist Party activities?

Mr. Nelson. As I stated previously, the company discharged me because I availed myself of my constitutional privilege.

Mr. Arens. Have you ever signed a non-Communist affidavit under the law as an officer of a labor organization?

Mr. Nelson. I have.

Mr. Arens. When was the last one you signed?

Mr. Nelson. Oh, I would say to the best of my recollection July of 1958. No. I believe there was one more recent than that, I believe it was October of 1958. I am not certain of that date. But it was somewhere in that area.

Mr. Arens. Were the statements contained in the affidavit truthful?

Nelson. I am certain they were. If they weren't, I am sure that the Justice Department long ago would have taken appropriate action.

Mr. Arens. Are you now, or have you ever been a member of the Communist Party?

Mr. Nelson. As you stated, I affirm, I have signed the non-Communist affidavit annually at least once a year for the past ten years. (The witness conferred with his counsel.)

Mr. Scherer. I ask you to direct the witness.

Mr. Nelson. I am certain, as I said before, if there were anything wrong with the affidavits that I submitted, the Justice Department long ago would have taken appropriate action.

Mr. Arens. Are you now, or have you ever been a member of the Communist Party? That is the principal question that is outstanding, please, sir.

Mr. Nelson. I think that my affidavit states that I am not a member of the Communist Party.

Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, I respectfully suggest the witness now be ordered to answer that question.

Mr. Willis. Yes, you are directed to answer the question.

Mr. Nelson. I have answered that question, Mr. Chairman. I said I am not, as my affidavit indicates, a member of the Communist Party.

Mr. Arens. Have you ever been a member of the Communist Party?

Mr. Nelson. My affidavit speaks for itself.

Mr. Arens. Mr. Chairman, I respectfully suggest the witness now be ordered to answer the question.

Mr. Nelson. I decline to answer the question in the manner in which the question is put. I have indicated my answer, that I am not a member of the Communist Party, that I signed affidavits annually, at least one a year for the past 10 years.

Mr. Arens. In these affidavits which you have signed

Mr. Willis. That is not particularly clear.

Mr. Arens. I can explore it with reference to the affidavit to clear up this point, if you please.

Mr. Scherer. There ought to be a direction to answer the question which there has

Mr. Willis. Are you now a member of the Communist Party?

Mr. Nelson. I think I said I was not. I said it three times.

Mr. Willis. Wait a minute.

Mr. Arens. The outstanding

Mr. Willis. Let's not equivocate. Are you now a member of the Communist Party?

Mr. Nelson, I said that I was not.

Mr. Willis. And you now said-

Mr. Nelson. Is that clear now? I am not.

Mr. Willis. Now, have you ever been a member of the Communist Party?

Mr. Nelson. I said if I had been a member of the Communist Party and signed affidavits saying that I was not, I am sure the Justice Department would have done something about it.

Mr. Willis. Now you have not answered my question and I order you to answer it. The question is. Have you ever been a member of the Communist Party?

Mr. Nelson. My affidavit says that I am not. My affidavit says that I have not been, and that is my answer.

Mr. Willis. You have not answered my question. Proceed.

Mr. Arens. Now, the affidavit which you have signed, the Taft-Hartley affidavit only states, does it not, on membership in the Communist Party, that you are not then at that instant of signature a member of the Communist Party, is that not correct?

Mr. Nelson. Well, I don't wish to engage in semantics on the question of then or now or anything of that kind. As far as I am concerned you know what the affidavit means. I know what the affidavit means. I know what the penalty for falsifying the affidavit is, and I assure you that I am not placing myself in jeopardy by signing a false affidavit. It means exactly what it says.

Mr. Arens. Now, the affidavit says, does it not, sir, the affidavit that you signed, "I am not a member of the Communist Party or affiliated with such party," is that correct, is that the affidavit you signed?

Mr. Nelson. That is what it says.

Mr. Arens. As of the time you signed the last Taft-Hartley affidavit in 1958, were you a person who had ever been a member of the Communist Party?

Mr. Nelson. You have my answer.

Mr. Scherer. All right. We haven't the answer. I ask you, Mr. Chairman, to direct the witness to answer that question.

Mr. Willis. You are directed to answer the question. You are not answering it.

Mr. Nelson. Mr. Chairman, I endeavored to answer the question honestly and fully that I have signed affidavits

Mr. Willis. We are not talking about affidavits at all. This is something brand new.

Mr. Nelson. - under the Taft-Hartley since 1949 which says that I am not a member of the Communist Party. And I will not go beyond the period which is covered by the affidavit. I will not go beyond that period because I do not believe it to be relevant or pertinent to the stated purpose of this particular committee.

Mr. Willis. All right. In other words, you signed or have signed non-Communist affidavits once a year, is that correct?

Mr. Nelson. At least once a year.

Mr. Willis. At least once a year. And that affidavit provides that on the day, on the respective days that you have signed those affidavits you swore that on those days, let us say maybe twelve times, that the only thing you have sworn to in those affidavits if you signed twelve of them, that on those twelve days that you signed them that you were not then a member of the Communist Party. That is all those affidavits provide for, isn't that correct?

Mr. Nelson. Well, I am not so naive as to believe that the late Senator Taft and his associates who drew up the Taft-Hartley law were so foolish as to put in the Taft-Hartley law an amendment that covered the moment that I placed my pen on the paper. The affidavit means exactly what it says, that for the past 10 years and any given moment of those 10 years that you can name or anybody else can name, I was not a Communist, or a member of the Communist Party.

Mr., Willis. Now, let me ask you, forgetting the affidavits, have you been a member of the Communist Party at any time for 1 minute, or 3 hours, or 3 months during that period of time?

Mr. Nelson. I have not.

Mr. Willis. All right. Now, have you ever been a member of the Communist Party at any time in your lifetime?

Mr. Nelson. Prior to 1949, which was the first affidavit I signed, I decline to answer on the basis that it is remote and irrelevant and is not pertinent to the stated purpose of this particular hearing.

Mr. Arens. Now, Mr. Chairman, may I explain on this record the pertinency and relevancy of that question to the subject under inquiry, and the relevancy and pertinency of the specific question insofar as it pertains to this particular witness? It is the information of this committee, sir, we have had some testimony to the effect, that upon the passage of the non-Communist affidavit provisions in the Taft-Hartley Act, a number of dedicated, hard-core members of the Communist Party resigned technical membership in the Communist Party, solely and exclusively for the purpose of being able to comply with the technical provisions of the law, namely, that they were not at the time members, technical members of the Communist Party. Were you a member of the Communist Party now, sir, immediately prior to the passage of the Taft-Hartley Act?

Mr. Nelson. I think I just got done indicating that I would decline to answer any questions concerning that period prior to 1949.

Mr. Arens. Why?

Mr. Nelson. For the stated reasons.

Mr. Arens. What stated reasons?

Mr. Nelson. That they are remote, irrelevant, and not pertinent to the stated purpose of this particular hearing.

Mr. Arens. Are those the only reasons that you are invoking now for declining to answer those questions?

Mr. Nelson. Those are the only reasons.

Mr. Arens. Now, Mr. Chairman, so the record may be abundantly clear, I respectfully suggest that this record now reflect an order to this particular witness now to answer the question which I shall now repeat, were you a member of the Communist Party immediately prior to the passage of the Taft-Hartley Act?

Mr. Nelson. I have already answered that question,

Mr. Willis. I direct you to answer the question which in effect means two things, that we do not accept your reasons and this is intended to warn you that we do not. So I direct you.

Mr. Nelson. You can accept them or not accept them. That is my answer.

Mr. Willis. In other words, despite my order, that is the same answer?

Mr. Nelson. That is the answer.

Mr. Arens. I respectfully suggest, Mr. Chairman that will conclude the staff interrogation of this witness. (Witness excused.)

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Credit: "Hearings before the Committee on Un-American Activities House of Representatives, 86th Congress, First Session, March 11, 1959." United States Government Printing Office, Washington D.C., (1959): 447-51. http://www.archive.org/stream/currentstrategyt02unit/currentstrategyt02unit_djvu.txt